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Why does PrimeGrid make my computer work so hard?
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Three tasks from World Community Grid can run in the background in near silence, but one PrimeGrid task makes my computer create a lot of noise, like the cpu is going into overdrive or something. Why is that? | |
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It depends on which task. Generally speaking, the LLR tasks are highly optimised and will push CPU cores very hard. You get the maximum work out in minimum time, but it does mean it can run hotter than less demanding tasks.
If you do the sieve tasks, they are less demanding so less likely to cause so much heat.
You can select which subprojects you do in user preferences. It looks like you currently allow any sub-project to run. Also judging from the hardware spec, you're running a laptop? | |
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Michael Goetz Volunteer moderator Project administrator
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Joined: 21 Jan 10 Posts: 13513 ID: 53948 Credit: 236,922,854 RAC: 0
                           
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Three tasks from World Community Grid can run in the background in near silence, but one PrimeGrid task makes my computer create a lot of noise, like the cpu is going into overdrive or something. Why is that?
Because our apps are so incredibly awesome.
Seriously, though, all kidding aside... it's literally because our apps are so incredibly awesome.
The people who wrote the two main software programs that we use on the CPU -- LLR and Genefer -- wrote them to make use of what's called the SIMD instructions ("Single Instruction, Multiple Data") which execute multiple multiplications simultaneously. Most programs don't use those instructions. This makes the programs much faster, and as a side effect use more electrical power. More power means more heat, and more means the fans spin faster, and faster spinning fans mean more decibels.
The GPU apps are also very efficient. Writing programs for GPUs is very tricky, and it's hard to do it well. Unlike normal programs, where a series of computer instructions is executed in sequence, the feature that makes GPUs so powerful is that they have not one computer, but hundreds or even thousands of computer cores inside. Making a program work on a GPU involves breaking the problem up into little chunks that can be computed simultaneously. That's notoriously difficult to do, and some computing problems lend themselves to parallelization better than others. The GPU programs that we have were not only written by superbly skilled programmers, but were also written for problems that lend themselves well to being run in parallel.
Inefficient GPU programs use a lower average percentage of the GPU cores (and consequently less power). Efficient GPU programs (and ours are very efficient) use a much higher average percentage of the GPU cores, and thus use more power. As with CPU programs, more power means more heat and faster fan speeds and more noise.
The sound you hear is the sound of math happening. :)
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My lucky number is 75898524288+1 | |
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RafaelVolunteer tester
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Joined: 22 Oct 14 Posts: 885 ID: 370496 Credit: 334,085,845 RAC: 0
                  
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Three tasks from World Community Grid can run in the background in near silence, but one PrimeGrid task makes my computer create a lot of noise, like the cpu is going into overdrive or something. Why is that?
Are you running the GPU app? If so, that's why your notebook is running so loud. Mine shows a similar pattern: crunching 2x WCG or 2x Primegrid on the CPU only get's a around the same temps, a little bit higher on the Prime side. But, as soon as I turn the GPU app, oh boy, temps go crazy. Even if it's JUST the GPU, the thing throttles. Both CPU and GPU (I believe the heatsink is shared?) go over the 80s with it.
So try not using the GPU app. It should help you keep temps and noise under control. | |
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It depends on which task. Generally speaking, the LLR tasks are highly optimised and will push CPU cores very hard. You get the maximum work out in minimum time, but it does mean it can run hotter than less demanding tasks.
If you do the sieve tasks, they are less demanding so less likely to cause so much heat.
You can select which subprojects you do in user preferences. It looks like you currently allow any sub-project to run. Also judging from the hardware spec, you're running a laptop?
I'm pretty sure I've set it to only certain subprojects. And yes, it's a laptop. | |
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Three tasks from World Community Grid can run in the background in near silence, but one PrimeGrid task makes my computer create a lot of noise, like the cpu is going into overdrive or something. Why is that?
Because our apps are so incredibly awesome.
Seriously, though, all kidding aside... it's literally because our apps are so incredibly awesome.
The people who wrote the two main software programs that we use on the CPU -- LLR and Genefer -- wrote them to make use of what's called the SIMD instructions ("Single Instruction, Multiple Data") which execute multiple multiplications simultaneously. Most programs don't use those instructions. This makes the programs much faster, and as a side effect use more electrical power. More power means more heat, and more means the fans spin faster, and faster spinning fans mean more decibels.
The GPU apps are also very efficient. Writing programs for GPUs is very tricky, and it's hard to do it well. Unlike normal programs, where a series of computer instructions is executed in sequence, the feature that makes GPUs so powerful is that they have not one computer, but hundreds or even thousands of computer cores inside. Making a program work on a GPU involves breaking the problem up into little chunks that can be computed simultaneously. That's notoriously difficult to do, and some computing problems lend themselves to parallelization better than others. The GPU programs that we have were not only written by superbly skilled programmers, but were also written for problems that lend themselves well to being run in parallel.
Inefficient GPU programs use a lower average percentage of the GPU cores (and consequently less power). Efficient GPU programs (and ours are very efficient) use a much higher average percentage of the GPU cores, and thus use more power. As with CPU programs, more power means more heat and faster fan speeds and more noise.
The sound you hear is the sound of math happening. :)
lol the beginning of that post
Ah, thank you. This explains a lot :)
(on a side note, is this why my GPU may have been damaged by PrimeGrid?) | |
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Three tasks from World Community Grid can run in the background in near silence, but one PrimeGrid task makes my computer create a lot of noise, like the cpu is going into overdrive or something. Why is that?
Are you running the GPU app? If so, that's why your notebook is running so loud. Mine shows a similar pattern: crunching 2x WCG or 2x Primegrid on the CPU only get's a around the same temps, a little bit higher on the Prime side. But, as soon as I turn the GPU app, oh boy, temps go crazy. Even if it's JUST the GPU, the thing throttles. Both CPU and GPU (I believe the heatsink is shared?) go over the 80s with it.
So try not using the GPU app. It should help you keep temps and noise under control.
Only the CPU app, not the GPU. I'm not sure about the temperature but the noise told me it was working pretty hard.
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Michael Goetz Volunteer moderator Project administrator
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Joined: 21 Jan 10 Posts: 13513 ID: 53948 Credit: 236,922,854 RAC: 0
                           
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(on a side note, is this why my GPU may have been damaged by PrimeGrid?)
Possibly. Laptops aren't really designed to run continuously at full power. Even so called gaming laptops don't run all-out 24/7 in normal usage.
If you do crunch on a laptop (I don't recommend it), you should use external cooling solutions. They sell "cooling pads" -- laptop stands that angle the laptop towards you (better ergonomics for your wrists) with fans blowing air onto the bottom of the laptop to provide additional cooling. Or just use a desk fan to blow air across the whole thing.
Always run the laptop while it's wide open. Even though it's possible to set it up so it will crunch when the cover is closed, that reduces the convective surface area of the laptop by half and makes the heat problem even worse.
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My lucky number is 75898524288+1 | |
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RafaelVolunteer tester
 Send message
Joined: 22 Oct 14 Posts: 885 ID: 370496 Credit: 334,085,845 RAC: 0
                  
|
(on a side note, is this why my GPU may have been damaged by PrimeGrid?)
Possibly. Laptops aren't really designed to run continuously at full power. Even so called gaming laptops don't run all-out 24/7 in normal usage.
If you do crunch on a laptop (I don't recommend it), you should use external cooling solutions. They sell "cooling pads" -- laptop stands that angle the laptop towards you (better ergonomics for your wrists) with fans blowing air onto the bottom of the laptop to provide additional cooling. Or just use a desk fan to blow air across the whole thing.
Always run the laptop while it's wide open. Even though it's possible to set it up so it will crunch when the cover is closed, that reduces the convective surface area of the laptop by half and makes the heat problem even worse.
And remember, TThrottle was designed with Boinc in mind, so make sure to use it! | |
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And remember, TThrottle was designed with Boinc in mind, so make sure to use it!
I highly recommend TThrottle as well.
http://efmer.com/b/?q=tthrottle
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Largest Primes to Date:
As Double Checker: SR5 109208*5^1816285+1 Dgts-1,269,534
As Initial Finder: SR5 243944*5^1258576-1 Dgts-879,713
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And yes, it's a laptop.
I run Boinc on my i7 laptop but have it set to only use 50% of the cpu, so it only runs on 4 threads instead of the 8 possible threads. Along with a cooling fan underneath the laptop and a GOOD backup system I haven't had any problems. In the past I HAVE had harddrives in laptops die on me due to overheating or over use, laptop components are not really designed to be used like desktops, although newer ones are getting better. | |
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(on a side note, is this why my GPU may have been damaged by PrimeGrid?)
Possibly. Laptops aren't really designed to run continuously at full power. Even so called gaming laptops don't run all-out 24/7 in normal usage.
If you do crunch on a laptop (I don't recommend it), you should use external cooling solutions. They sell "cooling pads" -- laptop stands that angle the laptop towards you (better ergonomics for your wrists) with fans blowing air onto the bottom of the laptop to provide additional cooling. Or just use a desk fan to blow air across the whole thing.
Always run the laptop while it's wide open. Even though it's possible to set it up so it will crunch when the cover is closed, that reduces the convective surface area of the laptop by half and makes the heat problem even worse.
I don't even run it 24/7, surprisingly enough. Thanks for the advice, I shall do this. | |
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And remember, TThrottle was designed with Boinc in mind, so make sure to use it!
I highly recommend TThrottle as well.
http://efmer.com/b/?q=tthrottle
Oh , awesome. Thanks! | |
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Almost all Laptop fans suck air in the bottom and blow it out the side, so that's why those cooling pads that blow air up onto the bottom are very effective.. But I have found that even propping the laptop up off the table to allow free air flow around the fan intake can result in a good 5degC drop on the Tthrottle graph! - I use a large "D-cell" battery at each corner to raise it up for better airflow!
- This tends to be a great deal more effective than any "metal-tray" heatsink method... (I've tried them all!)
Don't forget a good blast of compressed air every now and again to blow out the dust!
(SHORT blasts - or jam the fan with a pin - to avoid over-spinning the fan and burning the bearings!!)
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SteveRC wrote (in part):
- This tends to be a great deal more effective than any "metal-tray" heatsink method... (I've tried them all!)
I've tried a kitchen sauce pan upside-down, and putting the laptop on that. Lame, I know, and it doesn't work well.
Don't forget a good blast of compressed air every now and again to blow out the dust!
(SHORT blasts - or jam the fan with a pin - to avoid over-spinning the fan and burning the bearings!!)
Thanks for that reminder. I'm pretty good about blasting out the desktop machines, but often forget the laptop (Macbook Air).
--Gary | |
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Why does PrimeGrid make my computer work so hard? |